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pangolin20Chapter Seventeen (Part I) | Table of Contents | Peek at the Glossary (Part I)
NRSG: A good day, everyone, and welcome back to BattleAxe! Last time, we finally got underway again and got a little bit of information about the Icarii and Avar. Now for the reader post:
On part I of this chapter, Chessy notes that the use of “pig boy” is rather more classist than having anything to do with him being “simple”. So there we go:
All the Isms: 8
She also pointed out that the reason Faraday is allowed to react more is probably because Axis is written as stereotypically “manly”, so no emotions for him.
She also notes that the astronomy bit puts her in mind of claims that “the Church suppressed scientific advancement and in particular the whole 'they persecuted Galileo!' thing”. Something to look out for in later books, I think.
Epistler also notes that the Ancient Barrows are ripped off from Tolkien’s Barrow Downs. Classy, Douglass.
On to the rest of the chapter, then!
Let me first begin with the “next bit” I mentioned last time:
He had always vaguely assumed that the land he had lived in, the Seneschal and the way of the Plough had always been, but now he was discovering that Achar as he knew it had once not existed, the Seneschal had once never existed, and that his own race and those of the Forbidden had lived side by side in an ancient land called Tencendor. It was unsettling.
So… Axis literally never heard any history of Achar in the thirty years of his life?! No story about the origins of the Seneschal? Nothing about how Achar came to be? I…
A Gold Star for Worldbuilding: 6 (+5)
This Is Not How Things Work: 16 (+5)
What a nice way to show off your lack of worldbuilding, Douglass! Seriously, this is awful. On that note, why would Axis be unsettled by finding out that Achar and the Seneschal originated? And are we also supposed to see this as being part of Axis unlearning his racism?
FYRP: 54
Ill Logic: 18
Wait… This is from chapter 1:
“one […] representation of the Divine Artor on the occasion that he had presented mankind with the gift of the Plough”
“Every Acharite knew that […] their forebears had driven the frightful races that had once dominated Achar […] back”
And see the next paragraph here:
~~~
“So,” he said smoothly after another moment, “men once ruled over the Forbidden, did they?”
Axis knows this was not always the case, and that the Forbidden once ruled over the Acharites! What is he going on about?! Did Douglass truly have him forget all this, for the sake of letting him “learn” this from the Brothers? This is actively insulting! You know what, let me import Kerlois’s creation…
Write It, And Keep It: 2
Also, why is he saying this “smoothly”? I get the impression he is angry with what Ogden said… only he knows that already! This scene truly fails!
~~~
Ogden smiled. “By no means, BattleAxe. The royal family of Tencendor came from the Icarii line.
Yes, the three races truly “lived in harmony” when they were ruled over by members of the Icarii only. That simply does not work, Douglass. If you wanted to go the “living in harmony” route, it would be better to say there was an Icarii realm, an Avar realm, and an Acharite realm.
FYRP: 55 (either make Tencendor more ideal, or acknowledge that it had problems, Douglass!)
The House of SunSoar supplied the Talon, the King, for well over five thousand years.
1) “The House of SunSoar”… That does defy the “Icarii” name somewhat, does it not? After all, Icarus fell after he came too close to the sun, but “SunSoar” seems to indicate that they can come close to the sun without problems. It is not a problem on its own, but the thematic clash is… interesting.
A Better Commando Name: 23
2) And the king was named “the Talon”. My, why could they possibly have been called “the people of the Wing”? More seriously, I do not think it fits very well. Let me see (can I do nested lists? Yes I can.)…
a) Why “Talon”? True, I can kind of see why someone would use it, but the metaphor is still somewhat lost on me. If Douglass wanted to use a metaphor for this, why not name the post “the Eagle” or something?
b) Also, why “Talon”? Why name the post after something the Icarii do not even have? And yes, I know they are supposed to be “birdpeople”, but they are not. Like, in Pilgrim, we learn that they only got their wings 6000 years ago, and before that, they were simply mountain people. If you want to go with “birdpeople”, that would be people like me, not the Icarii.
c) So, I will give it this:
A Better Commando Name: 24
3) So, in all those thousands of years, there never was a queen? Not even with the “enlightened” race? How very feminist.
No-Wave Feminism: 12
4) Note, again, the ridiculous timescales. “Well over five thousand years”. How did a single dynasty last that long?
This Is Not How Things Work: 17
5) Finally, maybe a single dynasty ruling over the entirety of Achar for over 5000 years is not a very good thing, Douglass? Yes, the Wars of the Axe were of course not good at all, but a rebellion might have done more good than harm. But apparently, this is supposed to be great.
FYRP: 56
They were a prolific house.”
That still does not explain why they stayed in place for so long.
~~~
Both Belial and Axis stared unbelievingly at Ogden. The Forbidden had ruled over mankind? It was unthinkable!
But you literally know this! Why is this “unthinkable”?! Make it make sense, Douglass!
Write It, And Keep It: 4
Well, Ogden then says quietly that it was the humans, under the influence of the Seneschal, who “usurped the Icarii rule” and drove the Icarii and the Forbidden away. And we knew all of that already, but thank you for mentioning it again. Axis stares at the Barrows, “his face set like stone”. So he is angry… because Ogden told him things he has already known for years.
Axis Is Angry: 8
He says “grimly” that tonight, the graves of the Icarii will “provide shelter for mankind”, as they ought to be high enough to block out the wind.
So they go to camp between the Barrows, grateful for the relief it gives “from the bitterly cruel northern wind.” Which we did not hear about before now.
Manage Your Info Better: 14
By now, the Prophecy has spread among most of the Axemen (that is going very fast), and there are “low discussion […] about the meaning of the ancient riddle” around most fires. Several people look north toward “the origins of the cruel wind” and up toward the “thick black clouds” that cover the sky. There is no more rain and hail, like when they went over the Plains of Tare, but the clouds are thicker now, “as if they [bear] within them a surfeit of ice and hatred, waiting for the moment when it [can] be unleashed upon the column of Axemen.”
So Gorgrael is about to attack. Understood. It might have been nice to hear about this earlier in the day, though. I also hope these clouds are “black” because it is evening, and not that they would look black in daylight, too.
Manage Your Info Better: 15
That aside, though, this is reasonably effective. Cut to that evening. Faraday picks at her meal, and then excuses herself and goes to sit in the night. Axis watches her and notes that she has been “acting very strangely” since he came back from the Woods.
He hopes it is “nothing of his doing”. He says that Faraday earned “his grudging respect over the past three weeks or so”. And when would that be…? That would be the 12th of September. They left on the 15th, so that actually fits reasonably well! He further explains that both Faraday and Merlion (who he still does not name!), have kept up pace “with no complaints or petty requests for consideration because of their womanhood.”
ASWLT: 8
No-Wave Feminism: 13
Why are we stuck with this misogynist brat again? Well, he explains that they cause “virtually no trouble at all”, and Merlion (so he does know her name! why does he keep referring to her as “Faraday’s mother”? You know, this gets a point)—
ASWLT: 9
—kept a firm eye on their “two remaining maids” too, which disappointed quite some Axe-Wielders.
He was surprised when he learned the Borneheld was betrothed to “the youngest daughter of Earl Isend of Skarabost”. So Faraday has older siblings? Why are they only implied now?
Manage Your Info Better: 16
Well, Borneheld has “evaded the ties of matrimony” for the last “ten years or so”. He preferred to keep “a succession of blowzy mistresses” at whatever place he was at.
All The Isms: 9 (classism, I think)
No-Wave Feminism: 14 (“blowzy mistresses”? Really now?)
And what is wrong with that, Axis? Blegh, the sooner we can be out of his POV, the better. He thought Borneheld would go for the offer of one of the richer lords, because “even with he grandfather’s estates”, she was not the richest heiress in Achar. Um, whose estates? Those of Isend’s or Merlion’s mother? Or is this a typo for “father’s estates”?
Manage Your Info Better: 17
PPP: 28 (I do not know what this is yet, so I will give it both)
Then… Well, see for yourself:
Surprised, that is, until the night Faraday had smiled across the campfire at him. Pretty now, she would be an extraordinary beauty one day, and was both graceful and perceptive.
Ouch. This hurts me to read. Why is there “Surprised, that is” when there is no mention of his surprise before now? It is also very clunkily written. Let me do a rewrite:
He had been surprised at this until the night Faraday smiled at him across the campfire. Pretty as she was now, she would one day be an extraordinary beauty. What’s more, she was both graceful and perceptive.
PPP: 29
Then, he thinks that it is no concern of his, though it is “[a] shame” that Isend chose Borneheld. “Borneheld did not deserve a woman like Faraday—and certainly would not know how to treat her.” Because he sucks, everyone!
Petty Ain’t the Word For You: 5
He says that Faraday is “intelligent and lively”, and she would be miserable “in the wilds of Ichtar” (really now?), because from what he has heard, Rivkah hated “her life in the province”. But Axis, Rivkah and Faraday are not the same person, so you can hardly draw conclusions from this! Also, I think that might have something to do with her being married to Searlas.
Ill Logic: 19
Like, if he said that he thinks Faraday would suffer from being out in Ichtar with Borneheld like Rivkah did with Searlas, that would make sense.
Anyway, Axis hopes that her life with Borneheld will not “rob Faraday of her honesty and directness.” He looks around the fire, and sees that the others are now engaged “in an energetic debate about whether or not Baron Ysgryff of Nor [has] actually spent some of his youth as a pirate on Pirate’s Nest.” (blank stare)
Let me first have a peek on the map… I see that Pirate’s Nest is the rather large island to the west of Nor, in the Sea of Tyrre. And let me also look in the glossary…
PIRATES’ NEST: a large island off the coast of Nor and close to Ysbadd and the haunt of pirates. Some say the pirates are protected by Baron Ysgryff himself.
I first note the inconsistency qua name. I think I will go with “Pirates’ Nest”, so:
PPP: 30
Also, with this extra information, the discussion does make sense. It would indeed be quite unusual for Ysgryff to protect the pirates, and I can see why some would think he had spent some time among the pirates himself. The only problem is that we should not have to go to the glossary to find this out! We ought to have the context here!
Manage Your Info Better: 18
Well, Axis smiles to himself and leaves the fire, walking in the direction that Faraday has taken. He soon finds her “sitting on a low boulder” just outside of the camp. She has her back to him, and is looking at the Barrows. He calls her name, and she jumps to her feet when she hears him, and turns to him. He can see she has been crying.
She mutters “Excuse me” and tries to walk back into the camp, but he “[catches] her arm” as she walks past him. Ugh. He asks what it is, and what he has done to upset her. She looks up at him, “her eyes gleaming with tears”, and she says that it is nothing he has done. She asks him to let her go, and a tear rolls down her cheek. And Axis still does not let go of her arm.
ASWLT: 10
He gently reaches up with his free hand and “wipe[s] the tear from her cheek with the back of her fingers.” Because we are now firmly in the “romance” territory. “Without thinking”, he lets his fingertips trail down to underneath her chin. Faraday tries to smile, and she says it is because “life plays such cruel tricks”. We get a bit of internal monologue where she thinks that she should not say what she wants to next, but Axis is just so close and his fingers are so gentle on her skin that she cannot help herself. So she says that she is betrothed to Borneheld “when it is his brother that [she] want[s] more than life itself.”
So Faraday is also attracted to Axis! There is a love triangle now! However will this be resolved? (I doubt it will be satisfactory, and I do not care much for this either way.)
Well, Axis is take aback by what “this girl” says. He thinks she is “too young, too dangerous, and the timing [is] all wrong”. And why is she “too dangerous”? The other two things I can see, but this… not exactly. So he removes his hand from her arm and slips it “into the small of her back”, pressing her against him. He whispers her name, and then leans down and kisses her.
How… very romantic. I just find it hard to get into when I have seen how awful Axis is, and how he has been to her.
Well, his touch is so gentle and light that Faraday has to strain on her toes to keep contact. (Then lean in closer.) The kiss deepened, “and for long moment they [hold] each other”, and then Faraday breaks off, by pushing on his chest and drawing back “with a small shaky laugh”. She tells him to forgive her, as she is not sure what “came over [her]”.
Axis “reluctantly” lets her go, and he looks at Borneheld’s ring on her left hand. He asks why. Faraday sees where he is looking and twists the ring away. She says it is because that is what Isend wanted, and because it would be good for her family. Axis says it is not what she wants, and he looks her in the eyes, “forcing her to tell the truth”.
She softly says that it is not what she wants, “but in the needs of a nation one girl’s wants are a very small thing.” She will go ahead with the marriage, as her honour binds her. At that, “Axis’ temper [breaks]”.
Axis Is Angry: 9
He says that it is not “the needs of a nation” that want it, but Isend’s greed and Borneheld’s lust. Because obviously, Borneheld is only in it for “lust”.
Petty Ain’t the Word For You: 6
That aside, I suppose he is correct, but what should she do now, then? Well, he goes on to say that she is “young and innocent” if she thinks that honour has anything to do with the marriage. He says there are “long months” before the marriage has to take place, and he tells her to think on whether she wants to marry Borneheld, “or whether [she] might be prepared to risk spending [her] life with someone [she] could learn to love instead.”
1) So “young and innocent” is an insult now? That is new to me. And what is she supposed to do about being young?
2) Do you really think she could break off the betrothal just like that? Yes, she might do it, given everything that is going on, but it truly is not as cut-and-clear as you make it out to be.
3) Axis, she can learn to love Borneheld. The problem is that you do not think Borneheld can love her!
4) By the way, is this an attempt to nudge her to you? You could have handled this considerably better.
ASWLT: 11
Well, he turns away then and stalks back into the camp, “his shoulder stiff with anger and frustration.” Faraday stands there for a moment, then she hears a step and looks in that direction. Veremund, with Yr “curled in his arms”, comes walking out of the darkness. He says they have to talk, and “we” “cannot allow this to go any further”. We then get this: “His eyes were golden in the night.” Because this is not at all certain to scare Faraday and make her distrust you.
Ill Logic: 20
And it seems that he, Jack and Ogden, at least, are going to talk about her possible relationship with Axis! Interesting.
Before we get there, though, I would like to take a peek at the glossary, and see if it might answers some questions I am wondering about. See you next time!
(no subject)
Sunday, 3 March 2024 22:27 (UTC)I didn't make a big deal of this last chapter since it's not a particularly common accusation, but there are people who claim the Catholic Church and, for that matter, religion in general somehow makes society more violent then atheism does.
Axis, you're no better.
I dare say Borneheld has a better idea of how to treat his wife then Axis has of treating his mistress.
... Is it just me, or does Axis only care about Faraday's happiness because he wants in her pants? It's certainly not love, if he loved her he wouldn't be trying to convince her to go against her conscience. I don't think he's tempted her to sin yet, so it's not quite the sin of scandal, but he is treading far closer to that line then is good for either of them particularly since as a member of a religious order, possibly even a cleric, his word carries more weight then if he were a lay person.
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 08:08 (UTC)... Okay, the ignorance of history isn't point-worthy, but it is rather eye-brow raising that something based on the Catholic Church, which includes its origin story in its Sacred Scripture, has not seen fit to record its founding.
NRSG: And completely contradictory. Because apparently having Axis and Belial be lectured on things they already know is worth the retcon... Come to think of it, I do think that merits a point.
I dare say Borneheld has a better idea of how to treat his wife then Axis has of treating his mistress.
Oh, me too.
... Is it just me, or does Axis only care about Faraday's happiness because he wants in her pants? It's certainly not love, if he loved her he wouldn't be trying to convince her to go against her conscience. I don't think he's tempted her to sin yet, so it's not quite the sin of scandal, but he is treading far closer to that line then is good for either of them particularly since as a member of a religious order, possibly even a cleric, his word carries more weight then if he were a lay person.
I certainly agree with you. I also note that he presumes to know who Faraday can or cannot love better than herself! What a good basis for a relationship...
And good point about his word carrying more weight.
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 09:41 (UTC)Borneheld is actually perfectly nice to Faraday and clearly trying his best to make her happy. Whereas Axis...
...yeah.
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 17:01 (UTC)(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 17:15 (UTC)Did the people who called this thing 'feminist' actually read it, or did they just see the author name and assumed that made it feminist by default?
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 18:49 (UTC)NRSG: Given that this trilogy won several awards... I would go with the latter.
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 09:35 (UTC)It is when you know what Sara Douglass' day job was. She was a fucking HISTORIAN. A PhD in Medieval History who taught at university level, no less.
Yes, I'm serious.
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 09:44 (UTC)NRSG: Yes, that is truly one of the stranger things about this. Was she any actual good at teaching, though?
(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 10:05 (UTC)(no subject)
Monday, 4 March 2024 17:22 (UTC)(no subject)
Saturday, 1 June 2024 14:00 (UTC)Not to mention that military leaders typically have a pretty good grasp of the history of the land that they're protecting.
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It seems to me that a lot of writers start off a bit uncertain, and then get more confident as time goes on, and they get more comfortable writing in the world of their creation. Douglass seems to be going backwards, and getting worse the more she writes. This thing is devolving into a full-blown fustercluck, and it's only the first book!
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It actually makes a strong case for why they should branch out. Bloodlines need new genetic material, and if you're reproducing like bunnies, you're going to run out of suitable partners if you stay in the same place for any serious amount of time.
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I know they say that ignorance is bliss, but I don't think the same can be said of willful ignorance. There's a difference between having very few facts of your history and eagerly sticking your head in the sand and refusing to acknowledge the facts that are persistently tapping you on the shoulder to get your attention.
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Oh, don't you dare. I will cut a bitch; don't tempt me. And I love how this implies that her distress is only important because he kind of likes her now, and if he still didn't like her, she could go eat dirt.
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What the hell does "blowzy" mean? I get that it's supposed to be an insult, but...WUT? Also good to see that the notion of casual sex = BADHORRIBLESHAMEONYOU is alive and well...
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Did he seriously just say that? HIM? Oh my god, I think I'm going to laugh myself sick.
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First of all, HANDS OFF! Secondly, what an ego you have, thinking that surely any woman who was crying must surely be doing it because of him.
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That's a pretty strong feeling to have towards someone you hardly even know. Bella Swan, is that you?
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And I see no mention of having someone who loves her in return. So, what, Axis wants her to fawn over him, but it doesn't matter whether she gets the same treatment?
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Especially since he already freaked her out to the point that she rode far away from him not that long ago. Her guard will already be up, and now you're just going to scare the poor girl even more. You suck at this, Veremund.
(no subject)
Saturday, 1 June 2024 15:16 (UTC)Not to mention that military leaders typically have a pretty good grasp of the history of the land that they're protecting.
NRSG: He certainly ought to know as much as possible about the Icarii and Avar, since he is supposed to defend against them! There we have another way that Douglass did not think her story through...
It seems to me that a lot of writers start off a bit uncertain, and then get more confident as time goes on, and they get more comfortable writing in the world of their creation. Douglass seems to be going backwards, and getting worse the more she writes. This thing is devolving into a full-blown fustercluck, and it's only the first book!
That is the impression I am getting, too! The next two books will be much worse than this one, from what I have seen.
It actually makes a strong case for why they should branch out. Bloodlines need new genetic material, and if you're reproducing like bunnies, you're going to run out of suitable partners if you stay in the same place for any serious amount of time.
Ah, but they have ~magic~ to protect them from the effects of incest, I guess.
I know they say that ignorance is bliss, but I don't think the same can be said of willful ignorance. There's a difference between having very few facts of your history and eagerly sticking your head in the sand and refusing to acknowledge the facts that are persistently tapping you on the shoulder to get your attention.
He also needs to be informed in order to be able to take on the supposed threat! He is willing to hurt people just so he does not have to listen!
Oh, don't you dare. I will cut a bitch; don't tempt me. And I love how this implies that her distress is only important because he kind of likes her now, and if he still didn't like her, she could go eat dirt.
Oh, I certainly think that is it.
What the hell does "blowzy" mean? I get that it's supposed to be an insult, but...WUT? Also good to see that the notion of casual sex = BADHORRIBLESHAMEONYOU is alive and well...
Apparently it means "unrefined"? And that will become quite hypocritical of him later on.
First of all, HANDS OFF! Secondly, what an ego you have, thinking that surely any woman who was crying must surely be doing it because of him.
Even if he knows she is into him, it is still quite egotistical.
That's a pretty strong feeling to have towards someone you hardly even know. Bella Swan, is that you?
No, I think that is Azhure.
And I see no mention of having someone who loves her in return. So, what, Axis wants her to fawn over him, but it doesn't matter whether she gets the same treatment?
Indeed it seems not.